State of InPhiNet

Oh I got that later - not HIS though lol

 

I think in some cases yes but not in all. I know Stephen had skype calls to vet a few but I don't think that was the case with everyone which is why we ended up with more than 18 people - I remember me and Rhi on a call counting them up and then asking Stephen why there were 24 and not 18 and he was like "ummmm dunno Whitehaze brought em in, most will probably leave anyway and this won't be the final group".

In your case he told us you were in then you weren't because you're husband was getting too aggressive. Then we were surprised when you showed up.

Frankly things happened very fast at that time, me and Rhi were mostly off to one side working on various things (like trying to figure out how the senate voting would work or what kinda website we should go with). I'd say there was no "go-to" person but for her she'd been living this for 6 months already and was having to constantly explain to people things. Believe me, me and her were in skype calls with people trying to bring them up to speed for like 20 - 30 hours a day at that point and we were both incredibly tired.

 

Should also point out that the way he described me there was even a bad description/exageration/lie lol

 

I'll just say this, the format and intent of what the 18 was to be changed a lot the day we went from like 5 to 24 people. You can actually hear some of what it was intended to be in the audio you posted. It wasn't aimed at being a forum where the 18 vote on every little thing - that came later sadly and hindered a lot of the progress.

That said, I don't believe in any of the intent of what the 18 was supposed to be anyhow and I'm not proud of my involvement in it in any way. It was a thing I did (everyone's gotta join a cult at some point in their life right?!)

And no Rhi spin, I haven't talked with her since August 2011. Just relaying the experiences I had with her at the time. She may even have a different view altogether who knows?

At the end of the day, we were never going to achieve anything, whatever any of us were told by Stephen was pretty much a lie of some sort - at the very least a bending of the truth to suit each person.

My guess is that he was looking for the most gullible and likely to stick around no matter what - but hey that's just a guess. It certainly wasn't anything that was marketed to anyone.

 

I never said that the group was already decided, just that the plan initially was to pick the right people for certain slots as they became known to us then all of a sudden we had a mass pouring in of people over a couple of days, that is all. Me and Rhi were both equally shocked when it happened but we were like "ok then let's go with it". I'm just relaying my opinion of why I think she was the way she was at the time. BTW at that point I'd already racked up hundreds of hours of skype calls with both Rhi and Stephen (not a brag I assure you) and she was wonderful the whole time. We all have our experiences I guess we definitely had our moments though!

I'm very aware of the conversation you just posted, listened to the full thing (which that isn't) the day after it happened lol and yeah I was the IT guy he referenced in that call

 

Hey Rose, some of that is mis-remembered.

Initial 18 was: Rhi, Myself, Dale and Whitehaze (who was sorta off to the side can't remember when he joined but was before the next bunch). Rhi was from at least August 2010, Dale somewhere around November/December. Myself January.

You and the rest all showed up at roughly the same time with Mark being the last of that group to join as member number 24. (yep we really had 24 people at that time!)

So we were sorta working away in the background trying to get things started (mainly me and Rhi TBH cause Dale was sorta checked out/unavailable). Whitehaze was with Celine and Richard in the chat rooms bragging about being in the 18 (Celine and Richard NEVER were). One day a few months later me and Stephen interviewed Horak with Whitehaze at his recommendation and he seemed ok on that call (little did we know). The plan at that point was to invite people one at a time as the right people seemed to float to the top. I think Stephen asked Hawk to join around that time cause of the videos he was doing on Avalon. Shortly after there was Paula and David (that's when the crazy Paula posting all over Avalon happened after misunderstanding what she'd been told). It went quiet for a bit and then all of a sudden Whitehaze started adding people one after another in the space of a couple of days to the skype group we had. Me and Rhi were very confused as to where all these people were suddenly coming from because it wasn't in the initial plan and I think that's why she was a little frustrated around that time.

Just so we're clear: the original plan for the structure of the 18 was this:
a) It was a think tank group to shine a light on the crazy happening in the world and then come up with solutions. Those would be voted on by a senate of people (with numbers no names) to decide where to put the money. Senate would be a diverse group of people from all geographies and comprise of 18 x 18 groups. There wasn't initially an intention to set up a forum at that point, just a website and figure out the voting mechanism.

b) the 18 would be a group of people with specialized fields and be split with a few in each of those things. From what I remember:
- Religion
- Spiritual
- Tech
- Science
- Journalists
- Infrastructure

I was invited to be a part of the tech group and also to be the administrator/designer for what we were building. I think Rhi was going to be Spiritual but not 100% on that.

Anyway, we were both pretty surprised when the flood gates opened and all these new people appeared that didn't fit the structure we'd been working with so far. I think that's why Rhi was asking why people were there. Also, we were both doing a lot of work in the background and everyone else just wanted to do social skype calls etc :p

 

Everyone learns and evolves, whether sociopath or non-sociopath. Sociopaths evolve in the direction of evil (a result of their lack of empathy), and so naturally they are learning completely different lessons than the non-sociopaths.

There are the con-artists, and there are the conned. The people who are conned might think they are bad people because they went along with the con, but does that make them like the con-artist? Compare the intent of the conned to the intent of the con-artists. Is it the same intent? Usually not.

 

That is one of the defining marks of a sociopath. With little to no empathy for others, how could it be otherwise?

 

Ah, so Brook gave you an ultimatum to remove me, or else she would leave. That is a very sociopathic reaction, one about reaching for power and control over another person. I note that UncleZook was hinting at the same thing in his post. People of sociopathic persuasion don't like me being around, it would seem. I can see why, of course.

That too was a very sociopathic reaction from Brook, again searching for power and control over another person.

Essentially, I did. I didn't know Brook was Star at Atticus1 until I was already seeing plenty of signs of sociopathic behavior from her. She was already a person of interest for me before I knew her history. But really, it doesn't make any difference, because sociopaths are sociopaths for life. No cure has ever been discovered. Every attempt to change them has made them even more devious.

That was propaganda, the preferred way for sociopaths to lie. There is some truth to it, as with all propaganda, because Stephen did play people against one another. But it's also a subtle lie, with built-in plausible deniability since there is no way to prove that you two were not pitted against each other.

Impressive! Meaning I'm impressed that you could "feel" that, because I usually have to work it out the hard way, through analysis, reason, and logic. UncleZook also picked up on the agenda that Brook was pursuing and was also hinting along those lines ("we need a moderator to rein in Chico, and I volunteer"), essentially cooperating with Brook. Sociopaths recognize one another very quickly and work together almost by osmosis due to their converging psychological perspectives. Zook has been searching for a long time for any means possible to shut me down and produce a "win" for himself. Brook was smack dab in the middle of trying to do the same thing, so of course Zook saw a "good move" he could make in the game to dominate Chico. It's really amazing stuff to watch sociopaths be sociopaths while they pretend to be non-sociopaths. I am grateful for the experience, despite the discomfort I have to endure.

I think that supports the notion that sociopaths don't change when you give them a free pass. They just get another opportunity to con you with improved sophistication while your guard is down.

I doubted her sincerity with the Pyramid thread almost from her first post there. All she was doing was hinting at what she might tell us about later. She was playing with us. Then she drowned us in cut-and-paste metaphysical controversy ("computer code" behind quantum physics), an obfuscation trick Zook would be proud of. And she tried to shut me down after my first reply to the thread (a reply which was on-topic, i.e. all about pyramids), claiming she didn't want any mention of sociopaths from me derailing her thread!

Sociopaths are charming, alluring, inviting, accommodating, captivating, vivacious, energized, enjoyable, and .... poisonous.

Bravo. Perhaps that should be posted prominently somewhere for new members to read.

I suggest that would be a bit too accommodating. She has cooked her goose, and she knows it. I know it, especially after her ultimatum you just told me about ("Chico or me"). You should also know it after all she has shown us presently and all she has shown you in the past. Of course, she is free to try to con us again, but she can't expect us to be complete noobs to her game or her psychological orientation. There's no getting rid of sociopaths, but there is getting wise to sociopaths.

 

Be careful what you wish for; you just might get it.

What you are describing seems to me to be the standard paradigm in forums, i.e. the Avalon model, or online social club. Do you know what that really looks like?

Why yes, that is indeed what it looks like. Nexus was the same, and Universal Spectrum is yet another example.

I would hope Inphinet could be better than that. What such a forum would look like, and how to make it happen are two important questions that still need to be investigated. But giving everyone a "free pass" is not the answer. Do you think Rhiannon or Stephen deserve a free pass? I certainly don't.

 

I personally like all the members here you all talk about interesting topics


we should all take a look at what we are guilty of or not in our own words
http://utminers.utep.edu/omwilliamson/ENGL1311/fallacies.htm

this very post is number 6 lol

 

In attempting to make sense of the insanity we find all around us, a key issue is "intent". You see, the actions of sociopaths (like IceCold or Stephen) are often identical in appearance to the actions of non-sociopaths. The difference is the intent behind them. Sociopaths deliberately mimic the actions of normal people because it is the best disguise available to mask their true intentions. The underlying intent of sociopaths is always service-to-self. Normal, empathetic people are oriented more towards service-to-others.

An example is the thread Zook started entitled "Was Hitler a sociopath?" Zook's intent was never a genuine inquiry into the true psychology of Hitler. His intent was to ridicule Chico's psychological assessment of Hitler as a non-sociopath and thereby discredit Chico's assessment of Zook being a sociopath! Likewise, Shezbeth's intent in his thread "Me in Metaphysics" was not about making a genuine inquiry into metaphysics. It was just a protected stage where Shezbeth could prance about and gratify his enormous and duplicitous ego. It was all about the "Me" he placed in his thread's title.

And what do you think is the real intent behind Shadowself's thread "A fabled Pyramid in Russia ~ Time ~ Chaos ~ Ubiquitous Frequency Oscillation"? I've already speculated that it was just a clever trap to ensure that Shadowself would have immunity from any "negative opinions" that Chico would surely develop. After all, you can be sure she witnessed how well Shezbeth fared, and she didn't want to face that herself, for telling reasons. And so far, that is all "her" thread has been good for.

And what is the real intent behind the thread Chico started called "Sociopaths / Psychopaths"? Do you really believe it is about educating people to better recognize the sociopaths among us? Or does it just pretend to serve the common good so that Chico might benefit in some selfish way, like covering up his own multiple personality disorders?

The intent behind the actions is what we have to examine carefully and question often. The intent of sociopaths is always disguised to look perfectly normal and innocent, when it never is.

 

Now that Nexus is gone, I see your lies about it are no longer constrained in any way. There is still a whole thread about Nexus at UP with enough information to expose your deception, Zook. But sociopaths are known to be bold liars, and you continue that tradition here in a most calculated manner. You are indeed worthy of my assessment of you being a sociopath. Besides that continuing confirmation, I am also enjoying how you push your normal boundaries when you feel you have your opponent at a disadvantage. Your lies grow bigger, showing the depths to which you will stoop as your true nature is exposed.

I know you expect everyone to just accept your word on this, but as the administrator of United People, I contest your word and state that United People has not failed once. It has been in operation ever since I founded it, with all operating expenses borne by me alone. Every post you have ever made there is still visible, UncleZook. I can say the same for every post made by every member of United People, except for Gypsy Woman, who completely rewrote about a half dozen of her own posts when I exposed her King Art2 sockpuppet account along with her false-flag attack against her publicly known persona. Since my purpose in founding United People was to create a forum with no censorship, by my measure it has been a success. By your measure, having been expelled by the members more than once, with the details of each case still visible to the public, I can see why you would claim UP is a failure. Hey! Wait a minute.... Is that where you got the number "three" in your quote above? From having been expelled from UP three times?

Your point being that Chico should be moderated, even expelled from the forum. You would do it yourself, if only you could. This is the real purpose of your post, to deceive and manipulate Rose (and anyone else that will fall for it) into following your desires.

I've been dealing with you since 2011, Zook. I know your talents for deception and manipulation. I see now that you have been holding some of those talents in reserve, for a "rainy day". You surprise me with this escalation. Good, I enjoy learning new things about sociopaths.

As a courtesy, could you link to some of these "spurious" accusations? I was under the impression that I made no accusations until my preponderance of evidence was solid and ready to accompany the accusation. If I didn't do that, it would be a failing on my part, and I would certainly want to know about it and take corrective measures.

 

Fair enough. I wasn't aware there was such a thing as automatic ignore on this particular BBS. That said, I'm not sure that ignoring idiots is the solution to a community board. A frog in a pot of water can ignore the temperature, which is then gradually increased without the frog's awareness until a critical point is reached when the frog becomes aware, but by then its legs are paralyzed to do anything about it. Onward to the boil, as it were. I never believed in the ostrich response as a solution, anyways. Those are temporary solutions, but in the end not solutions at all. One may even argue that the current corrupt state of the world is a direct result of too many mothers turning away, often inwards, whilst the children marked up the walls with crayons, mashed potatoes, and booger ink. In a manner of speaking.

Question begs, why have any moderating functions at all (e.g. beyond self-moderation) if we're not going to use them?

As a moderator at three different forums (Avalon, Nexus, Universal Spectrum) ... I have seen the winds of war blow their way across the forum plains and leave a diminished landscape behind each time. Avalon was doomed to be a kool-aid joint due to the autocratic design of things with Sweet William The Con-Curer at the helm. Nexus was much better in this regard but still lost its way soon after Chico - who was invited into the mod staff primarily at my behest (boy, do I regret that mistake) - started irritating the peace of the MOD chamber with accusations of censorship (and other misconduct) against two of the staff members.

Chico essentially wanted a forum without moderation and he tried to force Nexus into his own vision of things via incessant natterings about the dangers of censorship and/or otherwise restricting speech. Never mind that free speech does not actually exist anywhere in the known Universe ... or that communities are doomed which do not observe some minimal standards of conduct and tools to enforce those standards - even against speech. Eventually, Chico's refusal to understand human imperfection led to his banishment from Nexus (which was of imperfection, for imperfection, and by imperfection).

Chico retreated to his own forum United People in the fool's ideal hope (but I have since concluded that he was never an authentic truthseeker, thinker, or free speech advocate to begin with) ... of founding a planar forum without moderation. The irony of United People is that it has become just as repressive as those other forums who never pretended to accommodate limitless speech. United People has now failed three times, each time with Icarus hitching a ride out of the ashes in the clasp of the Phoenix, only to be unclasped and left to the mercy of the Sun and waxed wings. The proof is in the autocratic decisions of its founder, poobah, five-star potentate, and reluctant self-appointed dictator ... that has rendered United People in its third and final incarnation, United Chico, aptly renamed by me because its community mission and membership has trickled to a virtual drop.

Getting back on point, it has been my experience that external moderation is required beyond and above self-moderation. Self-moderating forums are the bounty of a future enlightened state of our species. IMO.

Well said. I agree wholeheartedly. My own motto is "Wear a thick skin and assume that others have their thin skin on."

That said, it's hard to coexist when an idiot refuses to abide the standard of living and letting live. Keeps attacking those members that he disagrees with or who - dare I say - have presented superior arguments to his own ... and who keeps following his targets from thread to thread with an incessant goal of labeling the sundry Nelsons of his sundry Waterloos, sociopaths. IMO, there is justification for taking action against such obvious calculated disrespect on first resort. I have seen other forums fail ... indeed, Chico's own forum fail ... because of calculated disrespect from idiots bent on disrupting the flow of ideas, e.g. the trolls.

This is your forum, Rose, and you can do as you wish. I've just seen the train roll out of the station too many times with good intentions and the rail corporation not paying enough attention to the accumulating debris on the tracks. I would be remiss if I didn't warn you about my sightings.

Point taken. But it has little application to the current situation. I haven't witnessed anyone trying to run anyone off with a power play. That said, the closest that anyone comes to power play behavior is Chico. Chico has disrupted more than one thread with his spurious accusations of sociopath. And he has indeed run off Shezbeth permanently, and myself semi-permanently, and who knows how long Shadowself's absence will span ... and largely because it's hard to participate in a discussion of ideas when some idiot keeps interrupting the discourse with howls and catcalls from a nearby monkey barrel.

Agreed. Truth will eventually prevail.

As for tolerance, as long as tolerance is limited to ideas we all gain. When tolerance begins accommodating calculated disrespect, we all lose. I refer back to the frog and the pot of water and the wisdom of doing nothing until it is too late.


Pax

 

The semantic sidestep is one of Chico's favorite dances ... the kind of prevarication that fifth column trolls often attempt in lieu of valid arguments.

Chico also subtly displaces the word opinion with the word evidence.

Your ability to assess a person's psychological makeups was discredited long ago, not least when you tried to claim that Hitler was not a sociopath. Shadowself's evaluation of your own psychological makeup as being PPD appears to have some merit ... as demonstrated by your paranoid claims of "Zook trying to pursue a plan of discrediting Chico". Your own absurd arguments and opinions (e.g. Hitler's purported nonsociopathy) have dug you a hole all the way to China ... beware of the liquid mantle as you climb down deeper and deeper, it's rumored to be real hot! I still think the evidence points to you being a fifth column troll, but PPD and fifth column trolling need not be mutually exclusive. Indeed, the banksters and Cass Sunstein's sundry propaganda ministries care not who they enlist; consequently, they often attract the meek of mind, and that includes broken minds such as PPDs.

I offer the above as the mental meanderings of a self-obsessed madhatter, barking out at a world poised to ensnare him. Chico might as well be Narcissus's alter-ego, staring long at a curved mirror and a frightening image of himself. In the end, he still belongs to the fifth column because he achieves the corrupted system's engineered purpose of attacking truthseekers and obstructing the truths. And I still think he is aware of what he is doing, so that makes him complicit.

That organization is to blame is self-evident. That organization cycles in scale from large scale to small scale to large scale to small scale to ... as empires cycle from rule to ruins to rule to ruins to ... is also self-evident in any proper study of the historical record.

By contrast, sociopaths have always existed as a certain percentage of the population ... a percentage known throughout human history by various names, names such as bad seeds, black sheep, evil eyes, scallywags, cutthroats, mandrakes, etc., and now, sociopaths. Sociopaths, the new name for a long standing phenomenon, are not known to cycle with empires. When empires collapse, the sociopaths within the organization atomize and become free range alongside nonempaths, nonsociopaths, and empaths ... and when empires erect into organization, the free ranging sociopaths molecularize alongside free ranging nonempaths, nonsociopaths, and empaths (yes, even empaths are dragged into the sociopathic organization of empires).

To wit, the large scale evil is in the organization, not in the sociopathy of individuals. Zimbardo confirms this when he argues that most evil stems from hierarchy, which is a form of organization and not a form of psychology:
http://hm.dinofly.com/UP/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1197&hilit=zimbardo


Pax

 

It was also the method Shadowself used to remove me from the Pyramid thread.

Yes. More precisely, this is the type of behavior prized and sought after by sociopaths. I suggest that is why both UncleZook and Shadowself use it.

I would very much like this to be the case, but the preponderance of evidence in the world that I have uncovered over the last 10 years suggests that the truth does not prevail. I'm not happy about this, but unlike many people, I go wherever the truth leads me.