Hello All

Discussion in 'Φ QANON & POLITICS' started by david, Jul 8, 2016.

  1. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    This would be our psychology.

    Duh. This has been my platform for years now.

    Right on! Been there, done that. Sociopaths in positions of power and control are clearly the cause.

    Gemma, you are like a breath of fresh air! Thank you! I don't think I would have any problems coordinating with Peter Joseph. Sociopathy is indeed a cancer which, if unmanaged, will continue to grow until it consumes the body of humanity.
     
  2. david

    david Member


    Were going in circles here chick. I am giving you the last word on your next post on this subject because it is not constructive at this point. Its time to move on....
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. david

    david Member

    The idea of modelling the human condition on different processes can sometimes be helpful. basically Marxism in addition to turning Hegel on his head took human relationship to production and modeled it on scientific processes, hence dialectical materialism based on economic stages of development.

    To see social pathology as somehow organic is not such a stretch, we tend to look at mental illness as a form of sickness allopathically to be treated with drugs and socially to be treated with interventions. Even the way we look at organic illness is related to different models (Focault writes about this) and processes human beings have confronted. It took us many years to make a clear cut distinction between punishment and rehabilitation. Skinner, with his paradigm in the 50's wanted to take us back a few centuries! until Chomsky won that debate. In Slkinner's model pathology was seen as something that could be conditioned out of us, this also related to social malaise, Clock Work Orange anyone?
     
  4. Rose

    Rose Φ

    Personally, I disagree with this premise. We are born with potentially perfectly functioning objective/conscious minds and subjective/subconsious minds. There is no built in fault within our minds. The fault is with the informational environments we are born into and those who control us. Our free will allows us to choose to accept and move whatever information we chose from our objective to subjective minds, impregnating the subjective, so to speak, as our operating system. The problem is not the basic functionality of our minds. It is in the morality and choices of ourselves and those around us.

    I, also, do not believe the problem is a free market economy. Once again, the problem is created by those who are using the system, not the system itself. Any type of financial system will have the same problem: corrupt individuals in control. It is hearts that must be changed.
     
  5. Gemma

    Gemma Member

    Yes, this is a "sensitive" area but nonetheless needs to be somehow addressed in a new workable egalitarian model for society as it is difficult for us to neutralize our subjective belief systems within discussions on practical, solvable, physical problems - which of course we actually know how to do very well i.e. the plumber and I don't need to engage in, nor agree on, our consciousness/spiritual belief systems when he is fixing the tap.

    What I appreciate about Peter Joseph's, (possible attempts to tackle the issue of consciousness, religion, spirituality, etc, within the realm of practically applicable systems), is the implication to not deny, but remain neutral, when it comes to everyone's personal belief systems in order to stay focussed on the objective practicality of solving the brutal inequality crisis we currently endure with the practicality of our advanced technology. For whether we believe in gods, demons, et's, non-materialism, materialism, etc, etc, really doesn't matter when designing a social system of egalitarian meritocracy. And when everyone wants to weigh in on objective practicality with their subjective belief systems the objective practical aspects don't gain sustainable traction and cooperation for change. (Imagine two opposing belief systems on consciousness shared by myself and the plumber. If we began debating this in the middle of fixing the tap . . . the tap would take far longer to fix than necessary; and what would actually be achieved by this distraction.)
     
    • Applause Applause x 1
  6. Gemma

    Gemma Member

    I am an advocate of open-sourcing and transparency so I find great applications within Peter Joseph's model for lifting humanity out of the cesspool of inequality and devolution; for an egalitarian resource based economy doesn't just apply to fixing the fundamentals of food, housing, health and education. Conditions would be ripe for all individuals to get off the slave wagon so they could immerse a great percentage of their time and energy within their lifespan into developing and exploring their imagination, inspiration, and innovation as well as having a level playing field for sharing their creativity; no matter what discipline they are inclined toward. The implications of this are astounding!

    (Incidentally I just love the comment from people: But what will everyone do if they don't have to work 40 hours a week, as if this is a completely alien, never before experienced, notion? rolleyee Ask those that were born into wealth and don't ever have to work a day of their life. Do some live out their lives as if on a permanent vacation, sure. But is this what the rest want to do even with the opportunity to do so? No!)

    Peter Joseph's vision for a resource based economy may not be the best vision for our future direction, nor is it the only one out there, but I do find it a remarkably solid vision for change nonetheless, which is more than what we get coming out of the repetitive, separatist closed loop systems experienced today.

    I personally agree wholeheartedly that heart intelligence needs to be applied, but rather than stall progressive change by everyone arguing over the science or philosophy of heart intelligence we can simplify it for practical use - empathic logic or psychopathic logic - and get on with the next phase of practically applying resolutions to humanity's physical needs. The offshoot of an egalitarian meritocracy is that humanity's emotional and spiritual needs are then provided with a social construct that enables, not disables, individual freedom of heart based consciousness to evolve; for in our current climate heart-based consciousness is overwhelmingly suppressed.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2016
  7. Gemma

    Gemma Member

    I agree that the "Clockwork Orange" meme is a barbaric direction toward healing - and it would/is/has been inspired/traversed by non-empathic individuals. A harmless fMRI, or a global awareness campaign about mass imitated psychopathic logic however, is not Clockwork Orange - and the implied intention toward it I find to be primitive in its application and counterproductive.

    What never ceases to amaze me is the phenomenal lack of imagination in discussions re problem solving. So many people pull from the past to not only justify and support our contemporary and historically diseased systems, but are so indoctrinated with the past that they use it constantly as their palette to choose from for recreating the future. This mindset consistently stalls constructive changes in thought, let alone evolution!

    It is as if a large portion of humanity doesn't understand the definition of the word NEW unless it is a reinterpretation/recreation of OLD with different clothes on.
    It is also as if a large portion of humanity believes that they do not have the tools available to think of alternatives to what psychopathic logic imagines for them.

    I personally find that imagination and inspiration become functional tools when a blank slate approach is persistently applied to problem solving dilemmas.

    EXTRACT from P.Joseph's paper: "Instead, they focus on individuals and certain groups or corrupt corporations and while it is needed in a per--‐case basis to target problematic areas it avoids the mechanism which is essentially creating the problem."

    I am also aware that from a visionary perspective and understanding for change it is difficult for me to pull back from that space into a "per-case basis to target problematic areas" and I am well aware that fundamental visionary change will not happen overnight, but with determined application can begin to transpire within a few years given our internet resource. So I will respectfully pop myself out of the per-case basis conversation and simply observe. wavvvve
     
    • agree agree x 1
  8. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    You are so generous, King David, granting me a last word! And you are so wise, knowing when the point of "not constructive" has been reached. Truly, a man such as yourself is rarely encountered.

    Marxism and Hegel on his head did what? You are starting to sound like UncleZook, good King.

    OK, you can drop a lot of big names and psycho-babble with the best of them. You know how to play the game, I'll give you that. But you haven't really said anything useful about mental illness. In fact, you are practically excusing it, similar to the way psychiatrists downgraded "moral insanity" to psychopathy, then sociopathy, and now to APD (Antisocial Personality Disorder). Now why would you do that, David? Could it be personal?

    Unfortunately, you haven't changed much in the last four years, David. You are still striking out despite some frantic swinging, hitting nothing but air. Don't think it has gone unnoticed.
     
  9. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    Exactly.

    It is rather astounding.



    As Morpheus remarks at 0:30: "You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it."

    A lot of that is derived from the deliberate brainwashing, mind control, and programming that we endure from birth which is handed down from generation to generation as "culture" by our parents and teachers. It's insidiously brilliant from the perspective of the ruling sociopaths.

    Yes, a journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step. I may be repeating myself, but I believe it's worth repeating.
     
  10. david

    david Member

    its funny when I read this post I had this vision of trying to decide whether to put the motorized cart before the horse, or let the horse have a go. LOl. It shows how our own sense of causation rears its ugly head. Whether we concepualize it or not, as I often tell my boys, the elites could never have predicted, or even had a predictive model for the internet. Youtube, GoFundMe and many of the other egalitarian practices in the internet are not perfect but they eliminate the Marxist middle man (capitalist) and when used properly have the potential to really create wealth that is not exploitive...at least not in the same way that it has been. So this modelling for a human paradigm with no distortions from a subjective nexus that sees itself as greater than the whole... in essence isn't that what a belief system is? is happening whether it is modeled or not!

    Incidently if you like this kind of approach Robert Humphries, retired Marine who passed away a few years ago, wrote extensively about how cultural bias creates violence and wartime conditions... in his mind culture replaces religion in predictive modeling regarding the effect of dehumanizing those who have different cultural assumptions... His example famously was the milk smelling, American... Vietnamese could not stand the smell that comes from our diet. Similar ideology really.