Hello All

Discussion in 'Φ v.3 The GREAT AWAKENING' started by david, Jul 8, 2016.

Draft saved Draft deleted
  1. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker


    It is rather astounding.

    As Morpheus remarks at 0:30: "You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it."

    A lot of that is derived from the deliberate brainwashing, mind control, and programming that we endure from birth which is handed down from generation to generation as "culture" by our parents and teachers. It's insidiously brilliant from the perspective of the ruling sociopaths.

    Yes, a journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step. I may be repeating myself, but I believe it's worth repeating.
  2. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    You are so generous, King David, granting me a last word! And you are so wise, knowing when the point of "not constructive" has been reached. Truly, a man such as yourself is rarely encountered.

    Marxism and Hegel on his head did what? You are starting to sound like UncleZook, good King.

    OK, you can drop a lot of big names and psycho-babble with the best of them. You know how to play the game, I'll give you that. But you haven't really said anything useful about mental illness. In fact, you are practically excusing it, similar to the way psychiatrists downgraded "moral insanity" to psychopathy, then sociopathy, and now to APD (Antisocial Personality Disorder). Now why would you do that, David? Could it be personal?

    Unfortunately, you haven't changed much in the last four years, David. You are still striking out despite some frantic swinging, hitting nothing but air. Don't think it has gone unnoticed.
  3. Gemma

    Gemma Member

    I agree that the "Clockwork Orange" meme is a barbaric direction toward healing - and it would/is/has been inspired/traversed by non-empathic individuals. A harmless fMRI, or a global awareness campaign about mass imitated psychopathic logic however, is not Clockwork Orange - and the implied intention toward it I find to be primitive in its application and counterproductive.

    What never ceases to amaze me is the phenomenal lack of imagination in discussions re problem solving. So many people pull from the past to not only justify and support our contemporary and historically diseased systems, but are so indoctrinated with the past that they use it constantly as their palette to choose from for recreating the future. This mindset consistently stalls constructive changes in thought, let alone evolution!

    It is as if a large portion of humanity doesn't understand the definition of the word NEW unless it is a reinterpretation/recreation of OLD with different clothes on.
    It is also as if a large portion of humanity believes that they do not have the tools available to think of alternatives to what psychopathic logic imagines for them.

    I personally find that imagination and inspiration become functional tools when a blank slate approach is persistently applied to problem solving dilemmas.

    EXTRACT from P.Joseph's paper: "Instead, they focus on individuals and certain groups or corrupt corporations and while it is needed in a per--‐case basis to target problematic areas it avoids the mechanism which is essentially creating the problem."

    I am also aware that from a visionary perspective and understanding for change it is difficult for me to pull back from that space into a "per-case basis to target problematic areas" and I am well aware that fundamental visionary change will not happen overnight, but with determined application can begin to transpire within a few years given our internet resource. So I will respectfully pop myself out of the per-case basis conversation and simply observe. wavvvve
    • agree agree x 1
  4. Gemma

    Gemma Member

    I am an advocate of open-sourcing and transparency so I find great applications within Peter Joseph's model for lifting humanity out of the cesspool of inequality and devolution; for an egalitarian resource based economy doesn't just apply to fixing the fundamentals of food, housing, health and education. Conditions would be ripe for all individuals to get off the slave wagon so they could immerse a great percentage of their time and energy within their lifespan into developing and exploring their imagination, inspiration, and innovation as well as having a level playing field for sharing their creativity; no matter what discipline they are inclined toward. The implications of this are astounding!

    (Incidentally I just love the comment from people: But what will everyone do if they don't have to work 40 hours a week, as if this is a completely alien, never before experienced, notion? rolleyee Ask those that were born into wealth and don't ever have to work a day of their life. Do some live out their lives as if on a permanent vacation, sure. But is this what the rest want to do even with the opportunity to do so? No!)

    Peter Joseph's vision for a resource based economy may not be the best vision for our future direction, nor is it the only one out there, but I do find it a remarkably solid vision for change nonetheless, which is more than what we get coming out of the repetitive, separatist closed loop systems experienced today.

    I personally agree wholeheartedly that heart intelligence needs to be applied, but rather than stall progressive change by everyone arguing over the science or philosophy of heart intelligence we can simplify it for practical use - empathic logic or psychopathic logic - and get on with the next phase of practically applying resolutions to humanity's physical needs. The offshoot of an egalitarian meritocracy is that humanity's emotional and spiritual needs are then provided with a social construct that enables, not disables, individual freedom of heart based consciousness to evolve; for in our current climate heart-based consciousness is overwhelmingly suppressed.
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2016
  5. Gemma

    Gemma Member

    Yes, this is a "sensitive" area but nonetheless needs to be somehow addressed in a new workable egalitarian model for society as it is difficult for us to neutralize our subjective belief systems within discussions on practical, solvable, physical problems - which of course we actually know how to do very well i.e. the plumber and I don't need to engage in, nor agree on, our consciousness/spiritual belief systems when he is fixing the tap.

    What I appreciate about Peter Joseph's, (possible attempts to tackle the issue of consciousness, religion, spirituality, etc, within the realm of practically applicable systems), is the implication to not deny, but remain neutral, when it comes to everyone's personal belief systems in order to stay focussed on the objective practicality of solving the brutal inequality crisis we currently endure with the practicality of our advanced technology. For whether we believe in gods, demons, et's, non-materialism, materialism, etc, etc, really doesn't matter when designing a social system of egalitarian meritocracy. And when everyone wants to weigh in on objective practicality with their subjective belief systems the objective practical aspects don't gain sustainable traction and cooperation for change. (Imagine two opposing belief systems on consciousness shared by myself and the plumber. If we began debating this in the middle of fixing the tap . . . the tap would take far longer to fix than necessary; and what would actually be achieved by this distraction.)
    • Applause Applause x 1
  6. Rose

    Rose InPHInet Rose Φ Administrator

    Personally, I disagree with this premise. We are born with potentially perfectly functioning objective/conscious minds and subjective/subconsious minds. There is no built in fault within our minds. The fault is with the informational environments we are born into and those who control us. Our free will allows us to choose to accept and move whatever information we chose from our objective to subjective minds, impregnating the subjective, so to speak, as our operating system. The problem is not the basic functionality of our minds. It is in the morality and choices of ourselves and those around us.

    I, also, do not believe the problem is a free market economy. Once again, the problem is created by those who are using the system, not the system itself. Any type of financial system will have the same problem: corrupt individuals in control. It is hearts that must be changed.
  7. david

    david Member

    The idea of modelling the human condition on different processes can sometimes be helpful. basically Marxism in addition to turning Hegel on his head took human relationship to production and modeled it on scientific processes, hence dialectical materialism based on economic stages of development.

    To see social pathology as somehow organic is not such a stretch, we tend to look at mental illness as a form of sickness allopathically to be treated with drugs and socially to be treated with interventions. Even the way we look at organic illness is related to different models (Focault writes about this) and processes human beings have confronted. It took us many years to make a clear cut distinction between punishment and rehabilitation. Skinner, with his paradigm in the 50's wanted to take us back a few centuries! until Chomsky won that debate. In Slkinner's model pathology was seen as something that could be conditioned out of us, this also related to social malaise, Clock Work Orange anyone?
  8. david

    david Member

    Were going in circles here chick. I am giving you the last word on your next post on this subject because it is not constructive at this point. Its time to move on....
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    This would be our psychology.

    Duh. This has been my platform for years now.

    Right on! Been there, done that. Sociopaths in positions of power and control are clearly the cause.

    Gemma, you are like a breath of fresh air! Thank you! I don't think I would have any problems coordinating with Peter Joseph. Sociopathy is indeed a cancer which, if unmanaged, will continue to grow until it consumes the body of humanity.
  10. Gemma

    Gemma Member

    Our Social Pathology is Imitating Psychopathy, (or for those that prefer, imitating a lack of empathic morality), and desperately needs to be addressed to assist us with transitioning and transforming our inherited cultural memes, infrastructures, organizations, and governing institutions. I thought the following paper by Peter Joseph could be useful to this discussion.


    EXTRACT: “Social Pathology” March 13th 2010, New York City By Peter Joseph

    I've entitled this "Social Pathology." I decided to use the metaphor of disease to describe the current state of social affairs and the trends it foreshadows and perpetuates. I was first introduced to this idea of relating social state to a cellular state by a man named John McMurtry who wrote a book called "The Cancer Stage of Capitalism." The rationale is pretty simple. Just as human beings have to deal with pathogens invading and harming their life system so too does the social system we all share. Of course, these societal diseases are not generated by ways of physical germs or the like.

    Rather, they come in the form of presupposed principles of preference cultural "memes" that transfer from one to another based on values and hence, belief systems. These "memes" or patterns of perspective and behavior are what eventually result from or comprise the cultural manifestations around us such as the ideas of democracy Republicans, Democrats, the American Dream, etc. In Chapter One we will examine the symptoms and hence diagnose the current stage of disease we are in.

    Then in Chapter Two we will establish a prognosis meaning what can we expect from the future as the current pathogenic patterns continue. And finally, in Chapter Three, we will discuss treatment for our current state of sickness and this is where the concept of a Resource-‐Based Economy will be initially examined. However, as an introduction to this I am first going to describe what I call the "invisible prison". This is the closed, intellectual feedback system that consistently slows or even stops new socially altering concepts from coming to fruition. [It] stops progress. Let me explain.

    The social order, as we know it, is created out of ideas either directly or as a systemic consequence. In other words, somebody somewhere did something which generated a group interest, which then led to the implementation of a specific social component, either in a physical form, philosophical form, or both. Once a given set of ideas are entrusted by a large enough group of people, it becomes an institution.

    And once that institution is made dominant in some way while existing for a certain period of time that institution can then be considered an establishment. Institutional establishments are simply social traditions given the illusion of permanence. In turn, the more established they become the more cultural influence they tend to have on us including our values, and hence, our identities and perspectives. It is not an exaggeration to say that the established institutions governing a person's environment is no less than a conditioning platform to program that person with a specific set of values required to maintain the establishment.

    Hence, we're going to call these "established value programs". I have found the analogy of computer programming to be a great way to frame this point. While there is always a debate about genetics and environmental influence which Roxanne Meadows will go into at length later in the program it's very easy to understand in the context of values meaning what you think is important and not important that information influences, or conditioning, is coming from the world around you. Make no mistake, every intellectual concept which each one of us finds merit with is the result of a cultural information influence one way or another. The environment is a self-‐perpetuating programming process and just like designing a software program for your computer each human being is, advertently and inadvertently programmed into their world view.

    To continue the analogy, the human brain is a piece of hardware and the environment around you constitutes the programming team which creates the values and perspective. Every word you know has been taught to you one way or another. Every concept and belief you have is a result of this same influence. Jacque Fresco once asked me "How much of you is you?" The answer is kind of a paradox for either nothing is me, or everything is me when it comes to the information I understand and act upon. Information is a serial process, meaning the only way that a human being can come up with any idea is through taking in dependent information that allows that idea to be realized.

    We appear to be culturally programmed from the moment we come into this world to the moment we die and I'm not going to drill in it much more than that. However, consequently, the cultural attributes we maintain as important values are most often the ones that are reinforced by the external culture. I'm going to say that again. The most dominant cultural attributes maintained are the ones that are reinforced by your environment. If you are born into a society which rewards competition over collaboration then you most likely will adopt those values in order to survive. The point is, we are essentially bio-‐chemical machines.

    While the integrity of our machine-‐processing power and memory is contingent, in part, on genetics the source of our actions come fundamentally from the ideas and experiences installed on our mental hardware by the world around us. However, our biological computer, the human mind has an evolutionarily-‐installed operating system with some seemingly difficult tendencies built in which tends to limit our objectivity and, hence, our rational thought process. This comes in the form of emotional inclinations. You know, I'm sure many people here have heard the phrase "Be objective!" No human being can be fully objective. That's one of the important things I learned, actually, from Mr. Fresco.

    Therefore, there's a very common propensity for us humans to find something that works for our needs given the social structure, and then to hold on to it for dear life regardless of new conflicting information which might rationally expect a logical change to occur. Change tends to be feared, for it upsets our associations. And, by the way, when it comes to maintaining income in the monetary system, you see this propensity in full force which I will talk about a lot more later.

    Therefore, any time someone dares to present an idea outside of or contrary to the establishment programming the reaction is often a condemning of the idea as blasphemy or undermining, or a conspiracy, or simply erroneous. For example, in the academic world investigation often becomes confined to self--‐referring circles of discourse: closed feedback loops which assume that the foundational assumptions of their schools of thought are empirical and only these experts, as defined by their established credentials are considered viable authorities therein often dominating influence over the public opinion.

    This is a doctor named Ignaz Semmelweis and please excuse my lack of Hungarian pronunciation but he was a physician who lived in the mid 1800's who performed childbirths. Through a series of events, he realized a pattern that there was a relationship with the transfer of disease and the fact that the doctors of the times never washed their hands after performing autopsies. The doctors of the time would handle dead bodies in the lower elements of the hospitals and then they would go up and they would perform childbirths without washing their hands.

    So, this doctor, realizing this pattern he started to tell his colleagues about this. He said "You should wash your hands before doing this before performing any type of surgery or childbirth especially after handling a dead body."He was laughed at. He was laughed at and ignored. He published papers and they were dismissed and ridiculed. And after many years of trying this issue, he was finally committed to a mental institution, where he died.

    It was many years after his death when Louis Pasteur developed the germ theory of disease that his observations were finally understood and people realized what a horrible mistake had been made. In the words of John McMurtry, professor of philosophy in Canada "In the last dark age, one can search the inquiries of this era's preserved thinkers from Augustine to Ockhamand fail to discover a single page of criticism of the established social framework however rationally insupportable feudal bondage, absolute paternalism divine right of kings, and the rest may be." In the current final order, is it so different?

    Can we see in any media, or even university press a paragraph of clear unmasking of the global regime that condemns a third of all children to malnutrition with more food than enough available? In such an order, thought becomes indistinguishable from propaganda. Only one doctrine is speakable, and a priest caste of its experts prescribe the necessities and obligations to all. Social consciousness is incarcerated within the role of a kind of ceremonial logic operating entirely within the received framework of an exhaustively--‐prescribed regulatory apparatus protecting the privileges of the privileged.

    Methodical censorship triumphs in the guise of scholarly rigor and the only room left for searching thought becomes the game of competing rationalizations." People tend not to criticize the social order because they are bound within it. We are running a thought program which has been installed on our mental hardware which inherently controls our frame of reference.

    To use a different analogy, it's like they're in a game and the idea of questioning the integrity of the game itself rarely occurs. In fact, members of society often become so indoctrinated by their socially acceptable norms, that each person's very meaning is framed by the dominant established value system and the interpretation of new information is consciously, or even sub--‐consciously, prefiltered to be consistent with their prior biases. Now, this basic idea understood let's hone our focus and briefly consider this mind--‐lock phenomenon as you could call it in the context of economics specifically, market economics.

    Actually, a more accurate term at this stage would be 'economic theology'. For, as this presentation will explore the majority of people on this planet not only have no idea how they are being affected negatively by the market economy at large, they actually, on average hold a steadfast commitment to its principles based on nothing more than the traditional indoctrination.

    I got an email once that said to me "If you're against the free market, you're against freedom." (Laughter) And naturally, I shuddered at this state of mind control that the dominant established orthodoxy has successfully imposed. Of course, this is how power is maintained and has been maintained by the dominant established orthodoxies since the beginning of time. And the trick, again, is to condition people so thoroughly into the established value systems, that any thought of an alternative is inherently ruled out without critical examination.

    And to show how deeply pervasive this phenomenon is you will notice that virtually all the activist organizations in the environmental, social, and political movements of the day always exclude the market system itself as a determinant of harmful effects. It doesn't even occur to them. Instead, they focus on individuals and certain groups or corrupt corporations and while it is needed in a per--‐case basis to target problematic areas it avoids the mechanism which is essentially creating the problem. This is the fatal flaw of what's happening in the so--‐called activist community today.

    Once we successfully took to the skies and could easily traverse the globe did our global leaders get together recognizing the phenomenal potential that technology had brought to humanity's table for uniting resources to ensure not one person was displaced in the global social structure resulting in homelessness and starvation, (let alone displaced via enforced ignorance due to coveting and suppression of innovation and education)? No! Why Not?!

    And why is this not considered, let alone questioned by our institutional leadership today, apart from the counterfeit orations to placate the masses amidst the declarations of patriotic fervour that does little more than ignite hostility? Why has this fundamental "logical" question not received the "meme-ship" it deserves? Could it actually be because "psychopathic logic" does not partner very well with "ethical logic"!

    Why are we as individuals so conditioned within our social constructs to accept that evolution and progress requires starvation, homelessness, and war? Whose psychological "logical" game are we actually playing? Why are we repeatedly deceived into accepting that no other system could be intelligently thought of, let alone implemented, to evolve our global civilization?

    [And by the way, there are innovative ethical global systems already on the table but they haven't gained enough traction yet to get to the fore of discussions for change. Why? Could it be because we have a global civilization dominated by psychopathic leadership? And if so, how do we fix this? Identifying the causality may be a good place to start, don't you think?]
    • love it! love it! x 1
  11. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    What you call data is propaganda. Propaganda is a mixture of true, false, and missing data. Learn the difference.

    An oxymoron is "a combination of words that have opposite or very different meanings". Most propaganda is created to deceive, and is thus created deliberately. That is no oxymoron.

    No, you're denigrating. The quality of the information on a forum is not dependent on its membership count. That you would even imply this reflects on the quality of your information.

    Propaganda is a means of deception to obtain a desired result. I suggest it is you that is obviously confused, being unable to define the meaning of those four events, or even know the way you "feel" about the Holocaust. Doesn't your "data" give you proper direction? It doesn't, because your data is propaganda.

    You are thoroughly lost, as you amply demonstrated in your opening post, and continue to demonstrate here. For that reason, I have little respect for your views.

    I am not listening, I am reading. You are simply not writing coherently because your ideas are not coherent. And when your views are composed of incoherent ideas, I cannot have much respect for those views.

    You're funny. You haven't been able to recognize anything new up to this point, and I don't expect that to change, so you will no doubt chalk it up as a major disagreement.
  12. david

    david Member

    Anarchy is a belief that people can survive with no state appuratus. It is not a need to tear down the state, nor a need to totally live outside the boundaries of the state. Many anarchists decide as a matter of principle not to participate in the state when people are being deceived. In my case I do not believe our votes count, so I do not vote. I also live according to very different values, for example my boys have been told to go to school for an education and not to get a good job. I actually told my youngest common core is nonsense perpetuated to dumb down the masses so they can tolerate boredom and slavery.

    However.... an anarchist need not abstain from all social and political activities. Foremost, one just cannot. While freemen and other assorted state abolishinists are always ready to cry foul regarding contracts we are drawn into, I would refer people to Socrates who, in The Apology, makes the case that we cannot help entering into a quasi contract with the state. We all use sidewalks, trash collection... we all benefit from farmers subsidized, which is why food is so cheap in this country. We are part of a social contract. In Louisiana for example, when there is a hurricane and the roads are blocked people drive until they arrive at a felled tree, where upon home owners in the immediate area give out chain saws while others push limbs...when the tree is cleared beers are passed out, and on to the next one. Actually this social contract makes it so that by the time the state attempts to clear the road, it is already cleared.

    For Socrates, in fact, we are de facto reared by the state, protected by it and even educated by it. He says that his own free will and act of protest grows out of his education at the hands at the state. He passionately disagrees with the state on the education of the young and will protest out of love for the state. I would agree that this is a good simple argument for why even repulsive structures like the political establishment and Common Core Nonsense in education, can create the seeds of rebellion and progress towards the very end of the political state even as these structures are made to deceive.

    I believe that I can choose how and when I want to participate politically, thats called being practical. While I won't be deceived I won't assume that people can have no control in this system. That is my own particular view. Again let me stress this is an opinion, nothing more, it is not data driven. If the powers that be had such control over us, would they ever allow for the seeds of rebellion? Yet precisely in their matrix at the most omnipotent parts, lay the very end of the very foundation of the matrix. I hope this does not sound like Hegal, as I hate Hegal but alas...
  13. david

    david Member

    Hes also a stone cold globalist. Yeah. in this day and age when pigeons are called soaring Eagles he is part of the old vanguard. I don't think the Repubs have a base anymore...since the left took over legislating morality with political correctness and all. Both parties are in for a shake up.
  14. Rose

    Rose InPHInet Rose Φ Administrator

    Wait, I forgot to mention the Supreme Court...
  15. Rose

    Rose InPHInet Rose Φ Administrator

    Diebold can probably easily ameliorate any of our opinions anyway, loooool. It is more fun to think we have a choice....
  16. Rose

    Rose InPHInet Rose Φ Administrator

    Newt reeks scandal ridden shady behavior and self-serving cronyism. Damaged goods. He can't speak a word without it sounding like deception.His wild eyed golden helmet-headed Stepford wife appears to have fried her brain with bleach. They are both reminiscent of Cheny/Bush Carlyle Group style hypocritical Dallas socialites. (Wasn't he completely against Trump before he thought he had a chance at VP?). I know I probably should not say this anywhere. But, I don't think these type of old-school republican candidates can appeal to anyone en masse anymore.
  17. david

    david Member

    You have decided not to accept data so it must not be true. Deliberate progaganda is an oxymoron sir. Well documented at what!? your rinky dink with 2 members? lol lol lol...Your joking right? Ive explained myself regarding why I do what I do. Propaganda is not an end result Chick, those events had a meaning of some sort and because they were disinformation in some respects (don't know if I feel that way about the Holocaust) it obviously confuses you.

    Look you want to entrench yourself into a position where you are comfortable. Its very disturbing to think there are things out there we could understand and its scary I get it. Im not scared of it. I respect your views, they are not mine.

    Finally you are not listening!! hear the keys! I never said we should know anything. Thats what you are trying to assert when I point out what I have found through the data. Knowledge is graduated and it comes incrimentally through the data. Its not a question of "Knowing" so much as understanding. You think this way because of your own absolutist view point. I only interpret data. The proof of this is I never discussed as aim to these events, merely a structure as to how they operate. Keep trying though this is fun! Unfortunately you might find we simply have a major disagreement of which I am ready to chalk this up unless you have something new to add.
  18. david

    david Member

    Talking about grandkids and golf?
    • LOL LOL x 1
  19. david

    david Member

    Yeah I don't necessarily cosign the strategy... But vice presidents are at times best left in back off stage. Trump kind of did this to himself, or perhaps, this is his first bone thrown out to the repubs, in which case it had to be thrown eventually. Either way its designed for a certain effect and in all probability it is not to highlight Pence.

    Trump may change the party for good, move it more towards the center as the dems become more and more towards neo con. These battles have to be fought carefully. Clinton has had to fight off so much it will destroy her. Good! But if i am Trump one thing I don't want to do is go into a fight for the presidency fending off the Romney's and George Wills while fighting the Clinton Campaign.

    He couldn't have chose the fat man from Jersey... that would have been suicide because of bridge gate and the fact that New Jersey is really corrupt... almost as much so as Florida. Taxes, cops ticketing everything, etc. Its just a hated state. That leaves Newt. What do you think of Newt? I could have lived with him as a VP candidate. Hes smart and knows his way around Washington.
  20. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    Just seeing it documented does not make it so either. You claim "we know" all these things but we do not. We only think we do, and that's what I've been pointing out with regards to your hypocritical assertions. So many instances of "we know" have turned out to be deliberate propaganda, like 9/11 or the attack on the U.S.S. Liberty or the Holocaust or the Wallis Simpson affair. Evidence for all of that is well documented at United People, and I won't repeat it here.

    That you concentrate on supporting Trump while and disparaging Hillary shows me you are still very much caught up in the game and cannot see the forest for the trees. This ridiculous American political game was deliberately prepared for all of us. You have not only fallen for it, but are so entrenched in it that you will defend it as real, which is exactly what you've been doing. I've done it myself in the past, so I know how easy it is to get caught up in it. If you know enough to be an anarchist and not vote, why don't you know enough to see how all of this circus has been expertly prepared for us, exactly as is done every four years?
  21. Rose

    Rose InPHInet Rose Φ Administrator

    This is a strange story:

    What were Bill Clinton, Tony Blair, and GW Bush doing at a High School graduation in Arkansas?
    "A storm forced former Presidents Bill Clinton and George W. Bush and former British Prime Minister Tony Blair to evacuate during a high school graduation in Little Rock, Arkansas. Evacuees were instructed to go to the bottom of the building. (July 15)"
  22. Rose

    Rose InPHInet Rose Φ Administrator

    Perhaps Pence can be trusted to remain robotic in his public persona, but a man who does not believe in evolution? I think this VP choice does do his campaign harm. Pence will be disliked by Trump's current base of public support. He will be liked only by his base of loser republicans insiders who would have never supported Trump if they didn't have to. I heard this morning he spent all night trying to get out of this pick.
  23. david

    david Member

    Just saying so does not make it so. Again its not wrong or right its where the data leads, its not really an opinion, its an observation, though I know its easier for you to think of it as a preference lol. What evidence do you have to support the conclusion that EVERY aspect of the Government is acting the same way, under the same guise? If you can prove that every last person is involved at this level and there are no exceptions than you are amazing, but somehow I doubt it considering you would have to speak to every last person in the government.

    Again, you may not like what the data says, but looking at whistle blowers testimony, individuals who claim to have interacted with the government on various levels, intellectuals of great repute, there is consistancy about certain observations. Among them:

    1) Much of the information that is "Juicy" is need to know, preventing individuals from forming a complete picture. So, taking information and verifying its consistancy from more than a few people often finds correlation... and often finds pieces of the puzzle that fit.

    2) People that do claim to see the big picture are often asked to correlate the details to find more correlation. Predictions also sometimes verify that a person was aware of certain events.

    Heres the thing Chic: Only a sociopath would not acknowledge the following: that continuing to demand that there is a large conspiracy that will NEVER allow one to see the truth...except when an occasional error is made..and then, a quick recovery by the masters fixes everything...puts it back in the loops that all flow to the top, is constructive. You want to know why? since you love to use that term so much?

    A normal person says: "I can try to change things because maybe its not that bad, or maybe I can catch a break, or maybe things will change, whats the harm?..." BUT a sociopath prefers the power of being right, even when being right is a null set! There is power , social control in declaring, "we live at the whim of evil overlords and I know this!! I resist it on a personal level and prosper!" But there is no power, no social control to be gained by simply stating "Well...I think the mechanisms of control are sufficiently strong that any data I have seen does not move me, but knowledge is such that new facts come to light and I don't know with certainty any more than most people." I mean you seem to confuse me with the information that I work with. The data is the data lol.

    Anyhow as much as it hurts me to say this, you do not have the power over anyone sir! If you have data that suggests we are working in such a dire situation lets see it. I will be starting as things progress to bring data about truth claims, data from various whistle blowers and other data such as I have put fourth showing that in the military there are competing interests. My interest is to see how this election will influence what happens in this country. Data from emails suggests that Clinton has a mandate to go to war with Russia. Assuange at wikileaks shows emails that show this, we know that the wife of the Ukranian ambassador is on tape implicating herself as starting the so called revolution in the Ukraine, and, telling Vitalie Klitsko to "back off" in his bid as president for the people representing independence. This is "proof" not speculation about evil overlords! We know Putin is against this, and no I don't have reason to believe this is manufactured.

    So Chic, by all means post what you like, but I would really like it of you would show proof of assertions.
  24. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    Just as with your initial post, you couldn't be more wrong. I deal with evidence, and I go where the evidence takes me. The evidence has been consistent, unambiguous, and unrelenting that the political process is orchestrated theater, dominated by sociopaths, and driven by their psychology focused on deception and manipulation in the pursuit of power and control over others. Analyzing that theater for consistency of accurate detail and genuine meaning is a fool's errand because the story is fiction, or more precisely, deception. Until you get over that hump, your "data" will lead you everywhere except towards the truth.
  25. david

    david Member

    Pence "does no harm" lol.
  26. david

    david Member

    You deal in sentiments. I am going where the data takes me. I don't assume anything has been "prepared for me" I watch and learn. Already I have found that there are competing interests at play, I have seen evidence of no feedback loop and while you assume one exists, I would rather continue going where the data takes me.
  27. david

    david Member

    Personality profiles often reveal the proper type to be groomed for the proper position. Take a "Cheryl Mills" for example, perfect for a lackey. Incompetence is descriptive...correct of course...but descriptive in a way that projects a sentiment. Many are chosen because they are perfectly competent to do the limited thing required of them. Its horrible really because many of the worse qualities of a human being become the best under the circumstances and these people are a mess because of it.
  28. Rose

    Rose InPHInet Rose Φ Administrator

    Well, a new terror incident pre-empts Trump's scheduled VP announcement tomorrow. Pence? I tend to fall asleep considering that choice. If he is looking to do anything but please the Republican establishment, what does Pence really add to his campaign strategy? Appearance of business as usual? I don't think that works with Trump. I almost think his son would be better. He at least would, in a superficial way, represent a different generation. He seems to be very well spoken and loyal. If I were advising Trump, I would say, VP is often just a figurehead anyway, think more of central casting with your choice, not a wonk policy advisor. You can find others to help you with details. You make a mistake if you think of your crazy campaign as business as usual. Do something different.
  29. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    Remember when 11,000 air traffic controllers were all fired by Reagan in August of 1981? While it is true that government jobs have a reputation of being secure, I'm not at all convinced the government is telling the truth about that security. And there are other ways to persuade government employees to carry out policy set by the department heads, who are carrying out policy set by the president, who is carrying out policy set by his handlers, who are carrying out policy set by whoever controls the money. The money still does the talking. How about being given undesirable assignments, or being passed over for promotion continually? I've seen both happen. When sociopaths are involved in leadership positions, they will find a way to get their underlings to perform as desired. Sure, there can be exceptions, but the carrot and the stick are mighty effective. I am reminded of General Montague Winfield, who I suspect was promised some important perks if he just didn't show up for work on the morning of September 11, 2001. I've dealt with this character, and I'm convinced from his behavior that he's a detestable sociopath, adept at charming and fooling just about anyone. Psychologically, he's much like Bill Clinton.
    • thinking... thinking... x 1
  30. Rose

    Rose InPHInet Rose Φ Administrator

    Not for governmental employees in my experience. The entire department may be restructured due to a national administrative change, and desks moved considerable distances, but government employees are difficult to get rid of. And, unless the GAO is due to arrive "tomorrow" for an infrequent inspection, informational security is extremely lax.