Hello All

Discussion in 'Φ Qanon & Politics' started by david, Jul 8, 2016.

  1. Rose

    Rose Φ Φ Administrator

    It is not necessarily an "either or" solution, Gemma.
    Not, necessarily Capitalism that is the problem.
    Starvation, war and homelessness is not necessarily the preference of non-sociopaths within a capitalistic system.

    I hope you will not think that one cannot possibly be objective because their mind contains historical information from somewhere...

    In 1825, my spouse's great grandfather attempted free distribution of communal lands to poor citizens who agreed to grow coffee when he served as the first head of state of Costa Rica. Coffee barons eventually took over and took great advantage of the system he put in place. What is to prevent this from happening in Joseph's scenario?

    My spouse's family holdings were ultimately nationalized. His grandmother, grandfather, and father were forced to flee from Costa Rica to America on a banana boat. His grandfather died in the great influenza epidemic in New York before the his wife and son could arrive.

    https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Mora_Fernández.
    mora.JPG
     
  2. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    Rose, that NLP video gives a good overview of general programming and brainwashing techniques, but it does not go into NLP (NeuroLinguistic Programming).

    At one point, I had the same question as Gemma about "What is NLP?" I did some research into it, and I found an amazing analysis of one of Obama's speeches where he uses many of the common NLP techniques. I documented what I learned here.

    Note that the information I link to in my post keeps getting censored, so I have had to repair the broken links in the past. I even had to copy the entire Obama speech analysis to my own server in order to assure a "permanent" link! Someone really doesn't want that one floating out there on the Internet. It's easy to see why...
     
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  3. Rose

    Rose Φ Φ Administrator

    I am not saying Peter Joseph is deliberately trying to deceive or that he does not believe in what he is promoting. I have stated his writing utilizes propaganda style persuasion techniques to promote his anti-capitalism message.
     
  4. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    Now you're talking! This is of critical importance. Every system, no matter how well designed or how good the intent, will be infiltrated, undermined, and corrupted by organized sociopaths if it benefits them! That's why the primary solution is to identify and disqualify sociopaths. Until humanity succeeds in doing that, no system, no matter how well designed, can succeed. The government of the United States of America is a classic example, going from idealistic principles to criminal corruption in less than 200 years. All of the well-intended "checks and balances" were of no use in stemming the cancer that organized sociopaths can deliver.

    Your spouse's great grandfather had a good idea with good intent. Organized sociopaths turned it completely around so that they reaped the benefits at the expense of the people. That's what sociopaths do. They are the root of nearly all human problems. I dream of removing the cancer that sociopaths represent just so I could see what kind of problems would then manifest in the body of humanity, absent the cancer of sociopathy.
     
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  5. Gemma

    Gemma Member

    Precisely. This is why the missing link that "shifted" greatly in my awareness for why exploitation, in all scenario's, is so rampant and commonly accepted, always traces back and defaults to the psychopathic [morally insane] logic mindset that humanity has been culturally conditioned and trapped into imitating - even when it goes completely against the grain of our natural empathic core. We, as humanity, have sold ourselves out to the morally insane. But as a collective humanity we have the power to change this dreadful mistake.

    I cannot see how any NEW construct can ever be successful without being coupled to a global paradigm shift away from psychopathic logic and into ethical logic. This is also what attracts me to activists like Peter Joseph; their intentions appear ethical, their innovative models have soundness, but they are missing a piece of the puzzle. I am keen to bring myself up to speed on this topic, then collaborate with Chico's extensive knowledge base, as I aim to bring this "missing puzzle piece" to their attention with a little help.

    (sorry this appears to parrot Chico's response somewhat but I was writing it at the same time. :))
     
  6. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    I see two things here. First, "propaganda style persuasion techniques" that do not entail deliberate deception or the use of real propaganda could actually be legitimate and valid persuasion techniques. Second, do you see something wrong with promoting an anti-capitalist message? In other words, do you have a bias towards supporting a capitalist system? The reason I ask is that I myself had a long-time bias towards supporting capitalism, because my training and the culture I was raised in were both oriented to direct my thinking in that direction.

    My wife's grandfather was French, and his favorite expression about Americans was "Les sals capitalistes!" In English, "the dirty capitalists!" I always thought this opinion was quaint and cute, but misinformed. Not any more. His wisdom is becoming more and more evident to me with hindsight.
     
  7. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    You've got it, Gemma. I have never seen anyone in the forums get it with such clarity before. How did it happen for you? What do you think it will take for others to "get it" like you did?
     
  8. david

    david Member

    Culture is brainwashing now? lol you and my sixteen year old could have a bang up committee. I am sending a file, this is for Chic and anyone else who appeciates the idea of the grand oppressor. Seriously my son was in a film contest in Baltimore and this was the second place finish...he was competing as a sophomore against upper classman,
    Yes. Dreams plug me in and actually help problem solve and i have learned to problem solve with them. Its a kind of logic that is more Jungian, relational logic where we look at objects, images perhaps, and see a way they fit together, belong together. This logic seems independent of time and uses a symbolic vocabulary.
     
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  9. david

    david Member

    Sorry Gema... The analogy was in reference to a model for the human behavoir and the actual behavoir. Do we first model the behavoir? or do we first act, and then create the model? or...the cart versus the horse, what drives what, if the cart has a motor?

    I find this important because what the post modern deconstruction people did in philosophy (Derrida, Focault, etc) was to analyze models for how people organized thought and action, then pulled them apart to show how they were constructed. Before that time thinkers like Kant, for example, looked at what we did and analyzed it, then created a system to explain it.

    Modern thinking has become very conscious of models, like the thinker you propose. Why is this? well if human thought tries to get its head around Quantum processes, the only way we can do this is to create models because quantum theory is based on every action having a series of possible outcomes. When we model this through computer technology, or through probability, predictive programming for an event to occur, or... in any epistemological way, then the model we use becomes as important as the actual information we seek...as a matter of fact the model and information often come together as one entity.

    This is the next step in our educational evolution in my opinion. From creating a system to explain human nature, to creating a fascimile, a model of human nature, to tear down all assumptions, in effect deconstructing our thoughtology...to eventually creating a predictive program for encapsulating the probability of all actions through an understanding of chance, probability, action/reaction....is where we hopefully are heading.
     
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  10. Chicodoodoo

    Chicodoodoo Truth-seeker

    Not just now. It always has been. Just like media can be brainwashing. Just like education can be brainwashing.

    Brainwashing, mind control, and programming are very similar in that they are attempts to control behavior. The primary intent is one of control. This is why sociopaths are so attracted to these techniques, because of their practical uses in achieving power and control over others. Intent is the key. When culture, media, or education are presented with the intent to control, then yes, they are brainwashing (or mind control or programming).

    I note how your post is oriented around discrediting, belittling, and denigrating me by placing me on the level of your child in a hierarchical ranking that sociopaths tend to use. Would your intent for doing this be one of control, to get me to behave in a manner more to your liking?