Hello All

Rose I don't know why Doo Doo thinks me wanting to introduce my son's video revolves around him...Sociopaths often do think every act is to discredit them....but in any case I will get you the file. I am introducing the film because it is a great piece and it deals with the topic at hand. Doo doo should like it actually... a shame he has already decided that it is there to shame him...I would never compare him to my 18 year old! My eighteen year old is too smart for that! Just kidding! Will get you the film and you will see why it makes sense for inclusion in this discussion regarding our overlords.

 

Actually I was ignoring you lol. Ahhh the inevitable moment where my dear friend Chickadoo has his feewings hurted because someone is unaffected by his posts. and then.... the person becomes a mean vile sociopath....ahhhh! But Chick is right!!! they are all around those sociopaths! insulting the sock puppet boys down at United... chick, chick and chick...the four members in good standing, in government, in the walls listening...everywhere. But my dear friend Chickadoo probably forgot that I already declared myself a sociopath....a mean, evil, ruthless, power hungry one.... I guess my tendencies got the best of me, insulting my dear friend...can I just abreviate to doo doo? I ignored you to control your behavior, a pox on my ancestors...then again I guess if I didn't ignore you I would also be controlling your behavior? lol poor doo doo, quite the simp really.

You tend to want confirmation bias but, you don't even really know what a sociopath is yet doo doo, that would be a good start, take it from your good friend. you have been calling people sociopaths for how long? the problem with confirmation bias is that there is no alternative...You are not capable of making a distinction between someone whom you dislike, or think about a certain way, and a sociopath dear doo doo. Thats why your comments tend to be so annoying after a while. You basically simply want a world where there is you, and those who agree with you...and the mean nasty sociopaths.

Dear doo doo so sorry to say most of us have figured out that the world does not work that way...usually around our 5th birthday actually. Sorry that I ignored you for a post, hope it was not traumatic, obviously you felt violated by this and need my attention so here I am doo doo what can I do for you?

Culture, education, propoganda are tools that people use and some people are sociopaths. Does that help? You don't need me to denigrate you doo doo you do a fine job yourself. Anyhow I am here for you.

That mean sociopath
David

 

That is the plausible deniability aspect to the game David is playing here. I already knew that was coming, but I expected it from David rather than you. But that simply illustrates how well the plausible deniability aspect works when it is properly constructed. Those not aware of the game will run with it in defense of the game-player, and that is the intent.

Yes, but it was set up by David who introduced the comparison of me to his young son. There was no reason to bring his son into the discussion. It was a deliberate ploy by David done to play on our emapthy. As a highly empathetic person, you picked up on it right away with great sympathy. This is an example of where your empathy, while normally highly admirable, is a severe weakness in the company of a skilled manipulator.

You might recall Shadowself doing the same thing when she introduced her deceased son into the discussion. Do you remember how you reacted to that, and how I reacted to that, and how different those reactions were?

Quite right. It is all documented at United People, where David was dsimon3387, but I understand it would be far too tedious to try to track the development of personalities there, especially since posts cannot be displayed in chronological order (which is a regrettable limitation of the forum software).

I agree, and this was my default position with David when he appeared here. As you saw from his first post, it was definitely not his default position, but I didn't allow that fact to affect my "clearing the slate". All that has transpired since then, however, has written quite a bit on the new slate that is unmistakably similar to the old slate. At this point, it would be foolish to ignore the old slate when the same patterns are being laid down.

 

In principle, I agree. You have suggested that Peter Joseph is using "propaganda style persuasion techniques" but without using deception or propaganda. So why does the style matter if the intent is to present the truth?

Then you should be aware that capitalism and personal freedoms are two separate concepts. We have been brainwashed as Americans to believe they are integrated, when in fact, as demonstrated by our current implementation of capitalism, they are inversely related.

Quite right.

My understanding of a resource based economy, which is not very solid at the moment due to my poor recall of the Zeitgeist videos, is that planetary resources are not "owned" but are part of the common wealth. There would be no centralized control ("Big Brother") deciding the allocation or consumption of those resources. Instead, humanity as a whole would have to make those decisions, with input from all.

As to your second point, without sociopaths in power, other systems would not necessarily all work just fine. All systems are not created equal. For example, one of the major problems of capitalism is the monopoly. It is an inherent flaw in the model that can only be solved by intervention from outside the system.

 

Not just now. It always has been. Just like media can be brainwashing. Just like education can be brainwashing.

Brainwashing, mind control, and programming are very similar in that they are attempts to control behavior. The primary intent is one of control. This is why sociopaths are so attracted to these techniques, because of their practical uses in achieving power and control over others. Intent is the key. When culture, media, or education are presented with the intent to control, then yes, they are brainwashing (or mind control or programming).

I note how your post is oriented around discrediting, belittling, and denigrating me by placing me on the level of your child in a hierarchical ranking that sociopaths tend to use. Would your intent for doing this be one of control, to get me to behave in a manner more to your liking?

 

Sorry Gema... The analogy was in reference to a model for the human behavoir and the actual behavoir. Do we first model the behavoir? or do we first act, and then create the model? or...the cart versus the horse, what drives what, if the cart has a motor?

I find this important because what the post modern deconstruction people did in philosophy (Derrida, Focault, etc) was to analyze models for how people organized thought and action, then pulled them apart to show how they were constructed. Before that time thinkers like Kant, for example, looked at what we did and analyzed it, then created a system to explain it.

Modern thinking has become very conscious of models, like the thinker you propose. Why is this? well if human thought tries to get its head around Quantum processes, the only way we can do this is to create models because quantum theory is based on every action having a series of possible outcomes. When we model this through computer technology, or through probability, predictive programming for an event to occur, or... in any epistemological way, then the model we use becomes as important as the actual information we seek...as a matter of fact the model and information often come together as one entity.

This is the next step in our educational evolution in my opinion. From creating a system to explain human nature, to creating a fascimile, a model of human nature, to tear down all assumptions, in effect deconstructing our thoughtology...to eventually creating a predictive program for encapsulating the probability of all actions through an understanding of chance, probability, action/reaction....is where we hopefully are heading.

 

Culture is brainwashing now? lol you and my sixteen year old could have a bang up committee. I am sending a file, this is for Chic and anyone else who appeciates the idea of the grand oppressor. Seriously my son was in a film contest in Baltimore and this was the second place finish...he was competing as a sophomore against upper classman,

Yes. Dreams plug me in and actually help problem solve and i have learned to problem solve with them. Its a kind of logic that is more Jungian, relational logic where we look at objects, images perhaps, and see a way they fit together, belong together. This logic seems independent of time and uses a symbolic vocabulary.

 

You've got it, Gemma. I have never seen anyone in the forums get it with such clarity before. How did it happen for you? What do you think it will take for others to "get it" like you did?

 

I see two things here. First, "propaganda style persuasion techniques" that do not entail deliberate deception or the use of real propaganda could actually be legitimate and valid persuasion techniques. Second, do you see something wrong with promoting an anti-capitalist message? In other words, do you have a bias towards supporting a capitalist system? The reason I ask is that I myself had a long-time bias towards supporting capitalism, because my training and the culture I was raised in were both oriented to direct my thinking in that direction.

My wife's grandfather was French, and his favorite expression about Americans was "Les sals capitalistes!" In English, "the dirty capitalists!" I always thought this opinion was quaint and cute, but misinformed. Not any more. His wisdom is becoming more and more evident to me with hindsight.

 

Precisely. This is why the missing link that "shifted" greatly in my awareness for why exploitation, in all scenario's, is so rampant and commonly accepted, always traces back and defaults to the psychopathic [morally insane] logic mindset that humanity has been culturally conditioned and trapped into imitating - even when it goes completely against the grain of our natural empathic core. We, as humanity, have sold ourselves out to the morally insane. But as a collective humanity we have the power to change this dreadful mistake.

I cannot see how any NEW construct can ever be successful without being coupled to a global paradigm shift away from psychopathic logic and into ethical logic. This is also what attracts me to activists like Peter Joseph; their intentions appear ethical, their innovative models have soundness, but they are missing a piece of the puzzle. I am keen to bring myself up to speed on this topic, then collaborate with Chico's extensive knowledge base, as I aim to bring this "missing puzzle piece" to their attention with a little help.

(sorry this appears to parrot Chico's response somewhat but I was writing it at the same time. )

 

Now you're talking! This is of critical importance. Every system, no matter how well designed or how good the intent, will be infiltrated, undermined, and corrupted by organized sociopaths if it benefits them! That's why the primary solution is to identify and disqualify sociopaths. Until humanity succeeds in doing that, no system, no matter how well designed, can succeed. The government of the United States of America is a classic example, going from idealistic principles to criminal corruption in less than 200 years. All of the well-intended "checks and balances" were of no use in stemming the cancer that organized sociopaths can deliver.

Your spouse's great grandfather had a good idea with good intent. Organized sociopaths turned it completely around so that they reaped the benefits at the expense of the people. That's what sociopaths do. They are the root of nearly all human problems. I dream of removing the cancer that sociopaths represent just so I could see what kind of problems would then manifest in the body of humanity, absent the cancer of sociopathy.

 

Rose, that NLP video gives a good overview of general programming and brainwashing techniques, but it does not go into NLP (NeuroLinguistic Programming).

At one point, I had the same question as Gemma about "What is NLP?" I did some research into it, and I found an amazing analysis of one of Obama's speeches where he uses many of the common NLP techniques. I documented what I learned here.

Note that the information I link to in my post keeps getting censored, so I have had to repair the broken links in the past. I even had to copy the entire Obama speech analysis to my own server in order to assure a "permanent" link! Someone really doesn't want that one floating out there on the Internet. It's easy to see why...

 

Maybe not. Consider this:

Suppose for thousands of years, human civilization has been led by sociopaths. Suppose those ruling sociopaths had an influence tens or hundreds of times greater than their proportion in the population (witness just the genetic influence of Genghis Khan). Suppose as a result, human society itself took on the characteristics of those sociopathic leaders. Suppose, due to their skills of deception, manipulation, secrecy, and control, the sociopaths influenced our collective minds to such an extent that we thought all this malaise and greed and domination and violence and tyranny and slavery was normal.

I suggest we don't even need to "suppose". I suggest this scenario is the truth.

That would mean society is indeed diseased. That would mean we have been brainwashed, mind controlled, and programmed. As such, we would not have the foundation to be objective.

Speaking for myself, I can clearly see how I have been brainwashed, mind controlled, and programmed from the moment I was born. I can see how it took a dozen years for me to ease away from that comfortable and rewarded position. I can see that my learned objectivity was not objective at all, but heavily corrupted by society itself. And I can see how society is diseased because of the past and current effects of the ruling sociopaths.

Can you see how modern capitalism itself is a corruption by ruling sociopaths of what was once a cooperative transaction among empathetic people?

I don't think Peter Joseph is trying to deceive and manipulate us in a selfish pursuit of power and control. I think he is genuine. I can be fooled, of course, and if you think he is fooling us, I would love to hear your supporting evidence.

 

I have absolutely no clue as to what you are trying to say here David? Could you please enlighten my cluelessness with a clearer approach.

 

??? I'm confused again here Rose re "propaganda tactics"?? My statement was a generalization and in all fairness could well have been viewed as being harsh when I look back on it. Harsh because there are actually amazing NEW concepts, innovations and inventions out there for replacing the old and contemporary, but due to our controlling capitalist influence they don't see the light of day. For example, alternative power, vehicles, transport systems, housing, etc, as well as social systems.

What I was attempting to highlight was the difficult task of turning off everything we have been taught and conditioned with, blank slating the palette in front of us, then recreating a new design. Being a visionary this is how my mind works because I am constantly in a state of flux between the portal of my vision/imagination and now. This makes it difficult for me to communicate at times, but I am aware of this and so do try my best to clarify.

 

My response was not personally directed at yours Rose - when I write my posts my minds conceptualization usually defaults to generalization - my bad, I should have made this clear.

I am not familiar with neurolinguistic programming, apart from having heard the term over the years and a quick google search. Can you illuminate me more on this and if, as you say, Joseph is a master at it for propaganda do you not view his intentions as noble? Or do you just disagree with his solutions? I'm confused as to why Joseph's research would be categorized as propaganda and for what purpose?

I am personally biased against capitalism in our current climate as I do not believe the "personal owners/controllers" of our resources are doing a very good job determining what resources are to be extracted and/or created, and how they are distributed/used. I also don't believe our system of government is equipped to make those decisions either when heavily influenced by capitalist stakeholders. Which is why my bias leans toward creating a new system which primarily deals with sustainable equality first, followed by individual sovereignty to choose to develop one's own "wealth" - wealth taking on a whole new meaning of course in this paradigm rather than being the coveting of resources.

Of course, no one wants starvation, war, and homelessness, but not wanting those things do not go hand in hand with Joseph's solution.

If that were true then we wouldn't have starvation, war, and homelessness when we have abundant resources, technology, and intelligence as a humanity to resolve these problems. Which is why the psychology of those in power that do want starvation, war and homelessness needs to be challenged as the proof is on the table and has been for a very long time.

 

its funny when I read this post I had this vision of trying to decide whether to put the motorized cart before the horse, or let the horse have a go. LOl. It shows how our own sense of causation rears its ugly head. Whether we concepualize it or not, as I often tell my boys, the elites could never have predicted, or even had a predictive model for the internet. Youtube, GoFundMe and many of the other egalitarian practices in the internet are not perfect but they eliminate the Marxist middle man (capitalist) and when used properly have the potential to really create wealth that is not exploitive...at least not in the same way that it has been. So this modelling for a human paradigm with no distortions from a subjective nexus that sees itself as greater than the whole... in essence isn't that what a belief system is? is happening whether it is modeled or not!

Incidently if you like this kind of approach Robert Humphries, retired Marine who passed away a few years ago, wrote extensively about how cultural bias creates violence and wartime conditions... in his mind culture replaces religion in predictive modeling regarding the effect of dehumanizing those who have different cultural assumptions... His example famously was the milk smelling, American... Vietnamese could not stand the smell that comes from our diet. Similar ideology really.